. >> greta: wouldn't you expect that the obama administration would be talking to assad, maybe through some other country, some other means, to find a place, an exit strategy for him right now so he doesn't release the chemical weapons and make some sort of way to at least plan how to take -- how to secure them? >> well, again, if you believe some of the things people are saying about the russian role, they may well be trying to convince him to leave, but there's a real problem here because one thing he and others in his regime would insist on is to be immune from prosecution for various human rights violations, crimes against humanity. very hard to get that kind of immunity. >> greta: i thought we did that all the time. we have historically. i mean, some of these bad people have gotten safe haven places. >> we're in a different environment now, unfortunately, and what it means is in the case of gaddafhi, they might as well go down with their boots on. if the choice is dying fighting for themselves or be convicted by the international criminal court, every incentive is to stay in power